explosivecombat: (And what have we here?)
Solf J Kimblee ([personal profile] explosivecombat) wrote2014-10-20 03:32 pm

037. [Text]

I come seeking discussion again today, which to most of you should probably be nothing new; if anything, I ought to apologize for it, but I suspect that will ring about as true as my usual apologies for the subject matter. For what it's worth, the subject is better than it usually is; take that as you will.

I'd like to discuss dreams today; I'm sure those that were here about a year ago know exactly why, but in the end that is neither here nor there, and you don't have to have experienced it to discuss this with me.

I'm sure we're all no strangers to very vivid dreams...? The sort that immerse you so entirely that they almost seem real...surely there are a few qualities here and there that mark them as dreams, but they're disregarded in favor of whatever is actually happening right in front of you. Dreams like that can hardly be said to be different from reality, can they? They invoke feelings within you; they encourage you to continue thinking about them long after you've awakened. You could even say that dreams like that have given you experiences that you might never have had, were you awake – you've gone on adventures and met people and done things that affected you, all while physically being asleep.

Say that there was a way to live like that forever.

Suppose that there's a machine that will put you under, rendering you solidly asleep and allowing you to experience whatever you want. The machine can simulate any pleasurable experience that you choose, instilling all the thoughts and feelings that would come with actually going out and doing those things for yourself in your waking life. There would be no pain or suffering; it would be an experience in pure bliss for as long as you were plugged into the machine.

Again, you could stay that way forever, if you so chose, living out the rest of your life in dreams, and it would be a pleasant experience that's custom-tailored to you. The only tradeoff is that you would be unconscious the entire time; the experience would be entirely in your mind, rather than anything you actually did.

Would you choose to go under and live the rest of your life happy but effectively comatose, or would you prefer to experience life for yourself, entirely awake, with all the imperfections and strife that may come with it?

You can answer me anonymously if you wish, because as usual, your identity doesn't interest me as much as your response does; if you really want to impress me, you'll tell me why you would answer as you did.
ossifragant: (⊗ without this head of mine)

[personal profile] ossifragant 2014-10-20 10:40 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm not going to complain. It's fascinating to see just what a person may pursue and how they justify it. I've seen plenty of that already. Both here and in Amestris.

It's the tangibility I'm after. You may have a very convincing dream where something feels real, but it's hardly the same thing as actually being able to reach out and touch it. Or take it. I suppose you could say that pain fascinates me as much as pleasure does. It's the give and the take- the balance between the two.

After all, there are those who find pleasure in feeling pain. Would this machine be capable of knowing the nuance?
glaciates: (EXPLAIN ❅ i can't believe this shit)

[personal profile] glaciates 2014-10-20 10:43 pm (UTC)(link)
I thought that would be obvious. Why would you ever want to live in a dream world instead of the real one?

[...Hang on, that doesn't answer the question, does it?]

There's no point in living in a world where everything is perfect. Part of life is making mistakes and learning from them. Yeah, you have to deal with the unpleasant things, but I think that makes you a stronger person. Overcoming the obstacles is just as important as enjoying things in life.

So in an ideal world you wouldn't have that. Besides, everything that happens in a world like that doesn't touch you physically. It's something I can't really wrap my head around, I guess.
cawsforalarm: (What? ✧ What is clear outside the noise)

[personal profile] cawsforalarm 2014-10-20 10:43 pm (UTC)(link)
Do you think there's more merit in something else?

[That's kind of what it sounds like.]
fauxtographs: (� incorrect)

[text]

[personal profile] fauxtographs 2014-10-20 10:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Absolutely not, Mr Kimblee!

[...wait, was that supposed to be anonymous? Oh well, never mind!

...that first line probably would have given her away anyway so uh]


I mean, if it's all fake, then what's the point? Besides, I'd go mad if I wasn't able to exercise!
fauxtographs: (� ponder)

[personal profile] fauxtographs 2014-10-20 10:59 pm (UTC)(link)
Good evening to you too! I hope everything is going well!

[Oh, wait, there was a question there-]

Oh, and as for your inquiry! It's a bit tricky for me to put into words, but well...if you were permanently in a state of bliss and happiness...how would you be able to tell that you were actually happy? If there was no sadness, or pain, you wouldn't be able to tell what happiness is.

Does that make sense?
ossifragant: (⊗ without the use of my brain and)

[personal profile] ossifragant 2014-10-20 10:59 pm (UTC)(link)
It's an interesting thought. And what if a person finds killing other people pleasurable? That might undermine the experiences of other dreamers, but that's not my problem.

The experiences may be real, the lessons learned from them equally real, but more than anything, this question asks what reality actually is, does it not? A blind man knows nothing of the visual world after all. Nor, for that matter, does the average human see as well in the dark as in the day.

The problem is that not all experiences are the same. The longer the person who decides to use this machine is asleep, the longer their body has to atrophy. I suppose for someone who is entirely after gratification it may no matter in the end, but the idea of having my body waste away isn't exactly my thing even if it gave me everything else I wanted.

Would you use the machine, then? No doubt that world might be entertaining enough to take a look at if nothing else.
glaciates: (WHAT ❅ wait i'm only in one episode)

[personal profile] glaciates 2014-10-20 11:00 pm (UTC)(link)
That's a good question. I hadn't thought about it like that. What I said before is what I think - it's not something I'd impose on anyone else. I don't really get why people would want to live their life like that, but if they really can't experience the positives in life then I guess that makes sense.

It's ultimately a decision I'm not going to make for other people. I'm not going to pretend to know what's right for everyone else.
solas_ion: (you were lock jawed in your ways)

[personal profile] solas_ion 2014-10-20 11:01 pm (UTC)(link)
It's better to stick to what you say, otherwise there's no point in saying it in the first place. Don't you think so?
cawsforalarm: <lj user=bloodlessons> (Heh ✧ Gets swallowed whole)

[personal profile] cawsforalarm 2014-10-20 11:17 pm (UTC)(link)
Well, maybe I would do that if I had convictions. I don't really care about morals or anything -- I just do what sounds like fun, and sometimes what people tell me to, when it's not stupid. My obligations kind of are my convictions, because they're what I care about.
doitrockapella: (HOOK ❖ come on up and stay awhile)

[personal profile] doitrockapella 2014-10-20 11:21 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't really know what you'd do; that's why I thought I'd ask. The argument against tends to rely on the value inherent in the pursuit of achieving the goal, and ambition...isn't always one of your strongest suits.

You're going to say that I'm the argument against, aren't you?
doitrockapella: (BACKFLIP ❖ spread these wings of mine)

[personal profile] doitrockapella 2014-10-21 12:13 am (UTC)(link)
It's a tempting thought — the ability to do anything that might arise in my wildest dreams, no matter how outlandish or implausible.

But I suppose if I took the machine, life wouldn't be so different from the way it is already, and I'd be missing out on all the fun of pursuing the dreams themselves.
glaciates: (HUH ❅ amestris is a circle isn't it)

[personal profile] glaciates 2014-10-21 12:15 am (UTC)(link)
Improvement over what, exactly?

[He's not sure if they're on the same page at all here.]

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